Hello Stuart, please tell us where are you all came from? What's your background?  What music inspired you in your teenage years?

We’re all from a small town on the East Yorkshire coast, called Hornsea. A place of Victorian seaside whimsy, fish and chips and amusement arcades and that pretty much influenced us as much as Bowie, Eno and Tubeway Army. When we got together in 1981, synthesisers had become cheaper and quite a few bands began appearing brandishing Moogs instead of guitars, particularly in the north of England, The Human League, Cabaret Voltaire, OMD etc, and we ended up being part of that. 

Was Indians in Moscow your first band? 

  No, I played guitar in a New Wave/Pop band, which I joined when still at school; we released a single but never got anywhere.

How did you meet the other band members? 

  We’re all from the same town so we all knew each other, but were all in different bands. At that time there was  A vibrant music scene in the area and it seemed like everyone was in a band. I bought an old synth from Pete (Riches) when he upgraded to the ARP Odyssey, The Gibson Les Paul of synthesisers, and after tinkering for a bit gave up the guitar. Pete and Adele (Nozedar) were in a band which wasn’t really happening, so I got together with them to start something new, which after a couple of personnel and name changes, became Indians in Moscow.

Where did the name come from? Why Indians, why in Moscow? ))) 

  It came from the song of the same name. It has to do with confusion, displacement, and being at odds with the world. Apparently. There’s no particular relevance to Indians or Moscow, I guess it just sounded good.

Do you remember the first show? 

  I do, I even have a tape of it! We supported International Rescue in the seaside town of Bridlington; it was a short set consisting of all the songs we’d written thus far. We were never the greatest live band and even though we were only one fingered synth players, that one finger, though playing the right notes, had the unfortunate tendency to not necessarily play them in the right order. The curse of Butterfinger as it was known. I have quite a few live recordings and I’m now compiling the best versions for release, butterfingers notwithstanding. There’s a number of songs we played live that were never recorded. 

Some of your songs have strange lyrics, well at least for pop band. What were the inspirations for your lyrics? 

  That’s probably a question for Adele, she wrote all the band’s lyrics. We wanted to steer clear of typical song subjects, less girl meets boy and more girl meets dead priest and kills father. Here’s a quote from one of our old press releases: INDIANS IN MOSCOW create music for modern savages. “We don’t write love songs” says Adele, the band’s lyricist  “it sounds somehow insincere, I prefer not to soothe people’s emotions by indulging in Cliché, but to excite their imagination by encouraging them to dream”
So there you have it. Though we often wondered what went on at planet Adele… 



Indians In Moscow released just one full-length LP with the original line up and then split up shortly afterwards. Can you tell us what happened?

  The crux of it was essentially management interference. Almost as soon as we secured management we were getting pressured into having a guitarist in the band which myself and Pete in particular where dead against. We weren’t averse to using guitars (I played guitar on a number of our recordings) it was just that we felt it was down to us whether we wanted to include a guitar part or not. When you have a full time member then guitar gets added to everything. We had many arguments about this over many months, and eventually relented and got someone in for the 84 tour. Apart from Jack Pelter (On which I played guitar) all the other guitar parts on the album were added after we had split up. I personally dislike most of it, because coupled with the big clattering drum machines (also added afterwards) it significantly changed our sound and now makes the whole thing sound dated. I much prefer our original versions (on the ‘Don’t Bite Me There! Album) which have a lightness of touch and still sound fresh today.

We seemed to be having quite a few disagreements with the managers, particularly over the way Adele was being treated differently to the rest of us, doing solo photo shoots, solo interviews, being taken to gigs separately etc, nothing necessarily wrong with that, but when there’s a lack of communication, resentments can build up. Eventually it all came to a head and the managers, instead of valuing the unique blend of personalities that go into making a successful band and trying to smooth things over, thought they could just get rid of me Pete and Rich, put a new band round Adele and carry on where we left off. Unfortunately it doesn’t work like that and the whole thing tanked.

It’s a great shame really because the material we were coming up with before we split was easily the best stuff we wrote. We’d have made a stonking second album. At least we still have demos of some of it.

The UK gave birth to many creative artists over the years. Some of them became popular Worldwide, some (unfortunately) not. Do you remember some of those bands from the 80s and can you recommend any to those who’ve just discovered this scene? 

  There was a lot of great bands around then, some of whom are still around today but I would check out early albums by The Human League, Blancmange, Cabaret Voltaire, Thomas Dolby, Tubeway Army (Gary Numan) and OMD, as well as artists like Family Fodder, Devo, Wire, Music for Pleasure, Punishment of Luxury, Kissing the Pink, Soft Cell, and especially my favourites, Cardiacs and Frank Zappa.

Anyone seriously into electronic music should also check out Walter Carlos and Tomita. They made incredible electronic albums of classical music in the 1970’s. Tomita’s version of ‘Pictures at an Exhibition’ by Mussorgsky is my favourite ever album and influenced me a lot when we started Indians in Moscow

International Rescue and fellow Hornsea band, The Vets have reformed and are worth tracking down on facebook. The Vets guitarist Neil was in Indians for a while.

How do you feel about the new wave of the new wave of the new wave? )))) I mean all that renewed interest in early 80s music 

  There’s nothing wrong with going back and discovering great music from the past. Everything goes round in cycles but I haven’t really paid that much attention to the new wave of 80’s influenced artists except perhaps, Gary Le Strange.

What music are you listening to nowadays? 

  I listen to a wide variety of stuff from Punk and new wave to country music, 70’s Prog Rock and Glitch Electronica. You can find great music in any genre. There are only really two types of music: Good Music and Bad Music.  

  Can you tell us about your current musical project and plans for the near future?

I’m now in a band called The Bloogs, in which I play guitar as well as record and produce. It’s about as far from the Indians sound as you can get as it doesn’t feature synths, drum machines or strange lady vocalists. It’s classic British Pop/Rock in the tradition of The Who, Blur, Beatles, Keiser Chiefs and Cockney Rebel. I’m really enjoying rocking out for a change instead of having to program beats. We have a single out called ‘Sideways’
I’m also preparing more Indians in Moscow stuff for release. As well as an album of demos and odd recordings, I’m also compiling a live album in the Frank Zappa tradition of editing, enhancing, segueing and overdubbing, to create a ‘virtual’ Indians in Moscow concert and there’ll also be hopefully, a remix album.
The bottom of the barrel will then have been well and truly scraped.

Nattsol: Greetings, Jeff! First question is traditional for "Grave Jibes" - please, introduce yourself in the way you like.
Jeff: Hello GraveJibes, I'm Jeff from Eleven Pond. We were a mid 80's post-punk dark-wave band out of Upstate New York. Thanks for writing to me Nattso! I'm in Los Angeles on my mac at a beach cafe watching surfer girls... and you're somewhere over in Russia? OK. Cool.

Nattsol: I know you and your "Eleven Pond" bandmates were inspired by 4AD and Factory whereas the USA are formost known by the deathrock scene. So could you describe this "dark punk" atmosphere in the USA of the 80's?
Jeff: The punk/dark-wave/new-wave scene in New York City back in the 80's was amazing! So much great music and style coming out of NYC in the 80's!!!... But I lived in a shitty little city (town) called Rochester NY about 6 hours from NYC. We lived in the shadow of the creative big apple NYC. Our little scene was heavily influenced by the NYC+London scene. Yet we tried to create our own identity. The scene was filled with mostly beginner punk/new wave/dark wave/psycho punk bands. Lots of very young cute girls and boys came out to see this scene at night. There were about 2 or 3 clubs letting this type of music go on stage. The drinking age was 18 but the clubs also let in 16 and 17 year olds. They let us play late into the night. And the police left us alone because the club owners paid off the cops. The weekend scene was filled with car sex, booze, speed pills, cocaine and late night breakfast. Yes, it was a bit wild, but also very innocent. There was no Aids disease yet... kids didn't carry guns... People were more forgiving. If you were a nerd or a disco girl or a rock+roll guy or a blues dude, you were still welcome in our scene. We just wanted to play live. We didn't care who showed up. We were pissed off about growing up in such a creative void and we just wanted our songs to be heard.

Nattsol: How have you become a musician yourself? I know you were a leader of the band, called "Red Violet Red", - could you tell me about this band? And did you have earlier projects?
Jeff: My parents forced me to play piano as a kid! Hahaha! Funny shit. But I wanted to be a guitarist. In time I taught myself guitar, bass, synthesizer and sound engineering. The bands I formed that ended up making records or cassettes with GAME HEN RECORDS were: THE OBSERVERS ( 7" single 1984) was a psycho-surf punk band that I sang and played guitar, influenced by the Cramps. RED VIOLET RED ( 8 song cassette release in 1985, and a 12" single released in 1985) a synth wave band influenced by Tears For Fears and The The. SPACE TRIO ( 6 song cassette release in 1985, 4 song 12" EP in 1985) the downtempo dark-wave experimental noise duo of Dan Brumley+ myself. influenced by 4AD records. ELEVEN POND ( 11 song 12" LP called "Bas Relief" released in 1986, the reissued by Dark Entries in 2009, and an unreleased 2nd album called "Assemblage" that is sitting on the shelf in my living room waiting for a label to release it!!!) Eleven POnd was influenced by 4AD, New Order, Joy Division, The Smiths... Original vinyl copies of the RED VIOLET RED 12" sell on eBay for about $500... and original vinyl copies of ELEVEN POND~Bas Relief sell for about $900!!! Crazy how the record collectors are now.

Nattsol: And apart from the recent re-release, is there anything of your bands to be found nowadays?
Jeff: ELEVEN POND got so close to 'the golden ring' that when the band fell apart, I fell apart emotionally. We had so many great gigs, the video for the song 'Portugal' was on MTV, it looked so good for us... Then it all caved in... So I took a 23 break from music. No bands. Nothing. I just did art. Then in 2009 people started emailing me about how to find the 'Bas Relief' vinyl LP? That got me going. I started playing music again. So I asked a pretty Russian girl named Evgenia that I met at the LACMA art gallery if she wanted to sing in a band? She was singing with her iPod on, and she had a really great voice. She was open to trying. So in 48 hours we recorded 2 songs and made a 2 videos as a band called FEMKA PROJECT. Our sound was dark synth-pop. We were loosly styled after the Russian band EMPLOSIA: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_-h6RrIYHg , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68dCiCh3TF4 ...but Evgenia had to leave the USA for visa reasons. She lives in Moscow now. After she left I was excited to do music again, so I posted an internet ad for a female singer and started working with a control freak named Carol. We recorded 5 songs and made 4 videos, but Carol was such a nightmare to work with, so we broke up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCbshSLk2Bs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzodfYPSzI8&feature=related ...Now I've reformed ELEVEN POND and am preparing for a solo show in many cities that I have been invited to play in. I changed the sound a bit since I'm solo. I'm going for a dark synth/dance feel with a strong minimal-wave sound. In the future I hope to find a guitarist who can also sing. I'm looking in many different cities. Then I'll set up gigs in those cities and play live. It's not normal, but its a creative way to keep it fresh for me. I have no interest on doing some 6 month 'tour' on the road with 4 or 5 smelly guys living in a tour bus. I'm way too old for that crap. I'm looking for a cool guitarist in Brooklyn, San Francisco, London, Moscow, Berlin and Tokyo.


Nattsol: Were there some goth/wave bands you kept in touch or shared the stage with, at the time?
Jeff: Back in the 80's ELEVEN POND played with a wide variety of bands. We played opening shows for Kajagoogoo, Modern English, The Jam, Love And Rockets... We drank and did drugs back stage with Iggy Pop, Adam Ant, Joey Ramone, Dave Gahan... Recently a few older 80's guys have moved to LA and I've spent time with them chatting over coffee (no drugs or alcohol anymore) like Martin Gore from Depeche Mode (he lives 2 hours north of me in Santa Barbara), Billy Idol up in the LA canyons, Daniel Ash from Love And Rockets (he's a DJ here in LA). They are all so normal now!

Nattsol: Ok, May be you can recall some particular stories/situations/meetings which happened on your musical way and which can reflect the atmosphere of the time?
Jeff: The 80's goth/dark wave/new wave scene wasn't so labeled. There was a lot of crossover in the crowd. And most of the best alternative music was happening at gay bars. So the scene was a real mix of weirdo's who liked to watch, gays who craved attention, yuppies looking to do coke at dive bars, punks looking to get drunk and act insane, and goths who at the time were more shoe-gazers than what the modern goth is now... and everyone got along. I remember doing a show in Buffalo and Cher and her boyfriend (some magician) came to the punk club and saw the 2nd half of our show. The crowd gave her a mixed reception... the gay guys loved her, the goth/dark wavers ignored her, and the punks threw beer at her untill she left. When she walked to her limo, her boyfriend slipped on the ice and threatened to sue the club. The crowd outside just ignored them. I think the 80's crowds knew they were the main attraction and didn't want some lame-ass celebrity steeling the attention.

Nattsol: You told that now you perform alone, but who were the musicians of the original Eleven Pond line-up? And why had it happened that you broke up with them and didn't invite to take a part in the reunion?
Jeff: James Tabbi- lead vocals, lyrics writing and melodica (James owns a giant electronics company now that supplies the army with technical missile parts) Dan Brumley- synthesizers (Dan lives in the woods with no internet) Jack Schaeffer- lead guitar (Jack owns a bagel shop and baked bread at 5 am every day) Tim Masik- live drums (Tim is a comedian in New York City) me [Jeff Gallea]- I wrote all the music and played bass and bass synthesizer. I invited James to be a part of the reunion, but he is a company man with children. ELEVEN POND was basically him and I. The other guys helped to form the sound.



Nattsol: You had several projects, and still, consider Eleven Pond as the most important for you. Why?
Jeff: ELEVEN POND was a magical band. We were way ahead of our time for Upstate New York. The songs were amazing. The melodies were so memorable. The lyrics were beautiful poetry. Because the raw talent was all there, no one in the band was any less than amazing... I had been writing songs for 5 years and had a huge collection of new-wave synth-pop music to choose from, James was in his vocal prime and was very confident and very handsome, Jack Schaeffer was a classically trained guitarist (I went to high school with Jack) who could play any style and never made mistakes, Dan was a trumpet player/synthesizer wizard (I went to art school with Dan) who could create any electronic sound, and Tim was a live electronic drummer who was still in high school and loved our band. I couldn't recreate that combination of people if I had a million dollars to do it. It just happened by accident. Every other project I've worked on before, or after, always had it's limitations... ELEVEN POND had no limits... only our egos.

Nattsol: So, correct me if I'm wrong, but Eleven Pond has two studio albums (one of which hasn't been released so far) and the videoclip. What can you tell about these works?
Jeff: We recorded the two ELEVEN POND albums in an abandoned swimming pool in Rochester called The Hamster Cage. The video was made by an unknown film student at the Rochester Institute Of Technology. We were just following the standard path most bands followed... record an album, make a music video of the hit song.

Nattsol: How did Eleven Pond split?
Jeff: James Tabbi and I didn't see eye-to-eye for our future. I wanted to move to NYC and do more synth-pop songs. James wanted to more IMB and industrial style songs. Then I opened a dance club called Club Zero so I started to put my creative energy into the dance club. Also one other ELEVEN POND band member had married a Sex Dominatrixes and didn't know it. They divorced and it affected his happiness.

Nattsol: What do you think about the re-release of "Bas Relief" by "Dark Entries"? How did it happen that it's reissued now?
Jeff: The reissue is great! Josh Cheon from Dark Entries did a fantastic job at getting a wonderful package together. He got a good engineer to remaster the original tapes, we did a silkscreened cover together ion San Francisco, and he put good energy into blogs and promotion. He found me by his friends blog that posted Bas Relief and wrote about ELEVEN POND. We hooked up and I liked him , so I decided to let him reissue the songs. The rest is history :)

Nattsol: Had you really been silent as musicians during all those years after the split? Actually, it's a bit hard to believe in it.
Jeff: It's true. I played bass in a few rock bands just to keep my bass playing skills up to date, but yes, I gave up songwriting and playing my original music for about 22 or 23 years. I was just so disappointed. I just turned my back on it. I have lots of musician friends and they always need bass players. So I just bounced around from band to band. The last ridiculous hipster rock band I was in before I started to take music serious again was a rock-a-billy band called The Cocktail Shakers. SO idiotic. I eventually got kicked out of the band for not having any tattoos and verbally torturing the lead guitarist who actually thought rock-a-billy was going to come back?! I guess most musicians are idealistic and blind to their own ridiculousness.

Nattsol: Have you been aware of the dark scene after the quit of Eleven Pond? Comparing the original post-punk and minimal synth with the contemporary ones, what can you say?
Jeff: Yes, I started going to goth clubs, dark wave clubs, new wave clubs and synth-pop clubs back in the 80's and I haven't stopped. I didn't go to that many punk shows because I liked dating girls. And the 80's and 90's punk scene in the USA had no girls! Well a few, but they were rough at best. I tended to chase the model types. They hated punk, so I also stayed away. The new dark wave and minimal synth coming out is really great! It's a mix of new style, new singers and 80's synth tones. People just dig 80's synths and drum computers.

Nattsol: Does the reformed Eleven Pond have some results to tell about?
Jeff: Yes, I have written 10 new songs for an album and I'm recording them. But I'm not sure what path to take? I could release the 1987 recordings as a separate album called "ASSEMBLAGE" (the idea for our 2nd release before we broke up) ... or put 5 songs from "ASSEMBLAGE" on the A-side, and 5 songs from the new material on the B-side? I was going to call the new release "QUARTER DECADE" because it has been almost 25 years since I played in the original ELEVEN POND.

Nattsol: What's common and different between old and new Eleven Pond?
Jeff: I an writing and performing a more minimal-synth, dark/wave sound. I sound similar to the songs Watching Trees and Ignorant Father, but not like the song Moving Nowhere. And I sound very different from the Assemblage songs! They sound like Art OF Noise. The new ELEVEN POND sounds more like Martial Cantarel or very early Human League.

Nattsol: And what about the plans of the project for the nearest future?
Jeff: I want to film a documentary about the minimal synth scene in the USA and Europe. I hope to play live shows in as many countries as I can, and film other minimal artists while I'm there. The minimal scene is where my head is at. I listen to synth music all day! Nothing else.

Nattsol: Thanks for the interview, Jeff! Any final words?
Jeff: Thanks for the interview Nattsol. It was fun to recollect about the old band!... but also a bit sad. I came to realize in the late 80's I was living in a small group of like-minded musicians who were influenced by this amazing scene in NYC and Europe, but it never really caught on in Rochester or other medium sized US cities? So we lived in our small 'bubble' and we played to small crowds in small clubs. But what the lack of live show opportunities did give us was the chance to write and record a huge collection of music! My greatest memories are of writing that music and hearing James put his haunting lyrics to it. Wonderful times! Some day I hope to release all the old songs from 1987 (10 songs) and the new songs (about 12). Although I really don't care if I can't get my synth music out there to people. I've lived with music isolation for 23 years. Life goes on.

Questions: Pall 'Nattsol' Zarutskiy
Grave Jibes Fanzine

OV: You just released live album "The Truth In Dark Corners". Can you tell us about the idea behind this album?

MB: Well i had been searching through old tapes i had up in the attic here at home... i was compiling an album of really early rare material for a vinyl only realease on German label Vinyl on Demand... the search uncovered recordings of 5 shows from our 1985 tour of Holland... with two unreleased songs and really different, early versions of the tracks that later became the second attrition album, "Smiling, at the hypogoner club"....and as i was always getting requests for music from this period i decided it was worth compiling an album from all this material.... it should be out there you know... not left in my attic...

OV: Looking back, early Attrition's music were strange and raw mix of minimal synth, post punk and industrial. What music inspired you ?

MB: We were inspired by a mix of punk and post punk... guitars and electronics.... from Cabaret Voltair to Joy Division to Siouxsie and magazine and P.I.L... later getting into more experimental music... but punk inspired us to pick up instruments...none of us could play...we just needed to do that... we had things to say....

OV: Album contains some previously unreleased songs, why didn't you release it before?

MB: Well the 2 unreleased tracks... The aftermath, and In the attic... never made it onto the Hypogonder club album... and after that the line up changed drastically.... so they kind of got lost.... and had never been recorded properly so didnt even make rarities albums later on.... i had pretty much forgotten about them so it was a nice surprise to find them on these tapes... took me back to memories of our studio in London in 85... we shared it with the Legendary Pink Dots.... it was a time of a lot of belief in all of us.... of hopes and plans..... :)

OV: By the way, please tell us about album title, is there something special about this name?

MB: "The truth in dark corners"....it is a line from the poem "My eyes" from the Hypogonder club album.... actually written by Marianne...it always meant a lot to me.... maybe it summarises what we have always been about...looking for the truth....

OV: Sleeve notes are by Justin Mitchell of Cold Spring Records, can tell us about your friendship?

MB: We go back a long long way.... i first met Justin at a show we did in his hometown, Northampton, in 1985... and we kept in vague contact... he then got into promoting and started his label... he booked us to play his "Pushing against the wire" festival in northampton in '92... along with the Pink Dots/In the Nursery/Meat beat manifesto etc...which was an amazing event... we lost touch for a while after that but for the last 10 years we have been the best of friends.... we live nearby and you can often find us drinking in an old medieval pub in Coventry... :)



OV: There's a strong dark element to most of your work. What inspires you?

MB: I am inspired purely by life... by the people their actions and events and interactions in my own life....that can be arts but is more likely to be personal actions.... so in that way attrition is pretty much autobigraphical.... but it is as much internal thinking as it is external influences....

OV: Do you have/had side projects?

MB: Very rarely... i have contributed to other bands occasionally... nowadays i often get asked to do that.... but as a non musician my contribution...apart from my voice... is more in the music production side... and i am doing that more and more.... so they are kind of side projects..depending on how you look at things :)

OV: You are the part of the legend called darkwave. Can you name us some bands from 80s to recommend to youngsters?

MB: Well the bands from England from the start like Cabaret Voltaire and Clock Dva and then a little later The Legendary Pink dots and In the Nursery and Portion Control and Psychic Tv and Chris n Cosey.... oh i can go on and on.... and most of these people are still making vital music today 30 years later.... which is impressive... but i believe they are all true artists...it was never about POP

OV: How do you feel about the renewed interest in early 80s music?

MB: Its a good thing. It happens to all eras a generation on.... from the original fans revisiting their youth and the new ones just discovering it.....and it means some of the lost music is found again.... which i think is important. Just remember the present is more important. that's all...

OV: Do you have other occupation beside Attrition?

MB: I was teaching music technology for 16 years but have recently stopped doing that....the education system here in the UK is falling apart.... but i may well be starting something privately in the near future... and i have finally decided to open up my studio to producing and mastering other bands.... something i never had time for before.... so actually i am busier than ever these days....

OV: From an early 80s Attrition appears to us as the beast with many faces: post punk, industrial, ebm, neo classical, dark ambient. Are you going to move towards new territories? What about dubstep or witch house? ;-)

MB: I have no pre-determined plans to move towards any territories in particular...i just work as i need to and explore anything i need to.... so i cannot say.... i do enjoy some dubstep... some of it is not so very far away from the early industrial sounds...but with something fresh about it.... i dont know what witch house is :)

OV: What are your future plans?

MB: Well i am finishing our long awaited new album.... maybe taking too long with it but it suits me to take my time these days so thats what i am doing in amongst all the shows and production for other bands... it will be worth the wait... "The unraveller of angels" will be with us very soon indeed.... and after that....well we shall see.... there is a lot more of attrition to be unravelled yet... :)

Thanks Oleg....
Martin Bowes, Coventry, England, 2011